You know, this is a strawman someone made for you to fight. And you are putting all that into the universe. Let’s talk about a brighter future. The way to create it involves investing the whole of the "Defense Budget " to build out the renewable energy infrastructure that we need to power that future. Fossils married to fossil fuels brought us here. If you are complaining that the present situation is bleak. Young people haven’t been running the public agenda the past 70 years. Mitch McConnell remembers knocking up Feinstein so that their kids could go fight for the Confederacy.
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I think this is where a provocative comic pasted on a local billboard could get them to tune in to the mainshow on TYT youtube channel or the website or the app. Also small questions or statements like, “can you handle the truth! Tune in to TYT” or "Jesus was a founding influence on the TYT channel on YouTube " with a picture of Jesus Gadoy 
i live in a busy corner, I’m thinking of making yard signs to advertise TYT 
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I think if Joe wants the people’s vote, the people should commit to voting for Dr. Cornel West then if Joe wants our votes, he can make him VP! Maybe Joe should think about being bipartisan with an Independent not just his friends the Republicans.
Join me in calling for TYT to host a debate between Dr. Cornel West and RFK Jr. 
you are awesome by the way, heard you volunteered for the Cenk campaign. Props. Thank you for all the work you put in. 
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I hear you as far as tribalism goes. I hate that tv brainwashed generations into only supporting one of the top 2 parties. But more and more people are independent or third party. So maybe we can start voting in more independents when the ones who drank the Kool-aid move on to greener pastures. I don’t know. I think corporate Dems like Joe are losers. I fear he’s Hillary 2.0 and he’s going to lose us democracy and then we go into the climate catastrophe with flamethrowers.
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That is wonderful!
If I may briefly step aside from the topic for just a moment. I don’t know if you’re on Instagram, but I follow an account called @indiarosecrawford. She makes the cutest scenes and videos of Frog and Toad in their little, miniature world, which is beyond cute. I just thought you might like it. 
Sorry for the interruption.
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I’m surrounded by Maga in deep red Missouri. If you go by state numbers we’re not that far from going purple, but when you check regions our only democratic votes are coming from big cities. We need to reach out in the broadest way, not just to older voters but the people they have and will influence in their lives.
At work I have to hear misinformation. At stores I have to hear disinformation. Anywhere you go in suburban Missouri you will hear vocal proponents of maga spouting lies if you’re there long enough and listening. Probably true for urban zones but I don’t make it there often. This isn’t unique to Missouri.
Has anyone started a collective knowledge board to dismantle maga mistruths? It often feels like a waste of time to debate a zealot, especially when they approach from a base of falsehood, but being able to discuss a point and not give in to the browbeat can make a difference for both sides.
If we can have a set of facts to fight false narratives that is shared and widely used, we might see some minds change. Also it feels better to walk away from a debate having made a point, whether or not it makes a difference.
If another thread on this topic exists please inform me.
Thanks everyone!
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I think that’s a great idea! You should attend the Operation Hope Zoom meeting on Wednesday night (7:30 Central/8:30 Eastern) and bring this up. They have a website dedicated to exposing Trump. Perhaps by creating another site or expanding the scope of the existing site, we can address MAGA disinformation as well. I would argue that it may be better to create a site aimed at fact-finding and disinformation debunking that is not adversarial. It just seems that sites promoting exposing Trump or MAGA, while probably truthful and legitimate, might not attract a broad audience.
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Don’t be adversarial be artful if possible. The more you directly attack someone the more they become defensive. The key is to allow a discussion that borders a debate, but meant to imprint harmony. This isn’t always possible so don’t fixate on that initial position.
You must have courage engage and overcome a long term battle of will.
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That’s so funny because I think we posted at the same time and said much the same thing; we both even used the word “adversarial.” Great minds, right?
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Woah, it must have popped up as I was writing I didn’t see your reply until now.
I notice there are a bunch of great minds around here as well!
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@drea_m_r_76 and @enduser make good points about this.
(And, despite my blue state ignorance), I would add that dismantling the mistruths is about more than what we know factually. For example, we know Trump didn’t win. And we know mostly why; not much voter fraud, contrary to the claims. Yet dismantling such a maga mistruth directly seems not very effective.
The dismantling is about how we know what it is we think we know, and why is it that we think we know things in the way we do. So, practically speaking, a collection of fact sets needs to also include such meta considerations to be effective at dismantling. 
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I have an idea for this. I’ll bring it up on the next meeting. I’ll try to make it before: I hope I will have the time+ for it.
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It is good to hear you have an idea for that; I would like to hear it, since it seems as if: the [reasons-why-MAGA-believe-things-in-the-way-they-seem-to] (which I would summarize in part as cultural authoritarianism), makes me suspect individual deconstruction won’t be effective, maybe at least without sociocultural deconstruction.
@fourthwall_dragon , does something like that follow from your line of thinking as well?
Also, I can’t make it to the meetings due to time conflict, and haven’t found the notes from them yet, but I would like to read more about this.
Lastly, our conversation reminds me of this interview:
I will say there is a fulfillment and lowliness problem not discussed by MR.
Many of these MAGA dudes are divorced guys having a second go at being bachelor or eternal bachelors. They likely have many people in their lives but few close relationships.
Many people just want to be part of something. It is a very powerful pull many will not question what they are joining before they have already joined.
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Yeah, @enduser . Your point reminds me of the kind of sociocultural entrapment many disillusioned Christians feel. Their sense of community being compromised becomes a kind of a sunk cost, and one might risk isolation when turning away (especially if their previous Christianity was the kind defined by political capture, like prosperity gospel).
These are the kinds of [reasons-why-MAGA-believe-things-in-the-way-they-seem-to] we’re talking about dismantling; it seems to me to require also reconstructing sociocultural shared identities, which seems to me to require a directly interpersonal approach.
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Yeah this is accurate frame as far as I can tell.
The culture is important; like the idea of a community oven that provides hot bread to all for a small margin above cost.
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Some of my thoughts in the linked topic seem relevant to this topic as well
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One-on-one is definitely the best way, and only way i have been able to push ideas. Just as Bernie did in West Virginia, we have to define and lay out what we believe in, to individuals, and many see them as good ideas. But mainstream has given us a name - the far left - and given it a bad connotation. What we need to be seen as is the ‘very middle’ or something similar. Show people that what we want is what most think is common sense.
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If uniparty corporate boot lickers call you far left or right that is a win in my book.
Next time ask them if AIPAC is speaking on their behalf or is it ALEC that fills their mouth with these trait musings?
When they are both trash it is easy to put them where they belong.
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